Dear Yosef Yaakov,

Your story is truly amazing!

I cannot get over the story with the airplane.  Hashem must have something very special in-store for you for having saved you in such a miraculous way.

I myself was mechazek myself to a large degree in Torah, Tefilla and Mitzvos and although my addictive behavior was mitigated to some degree, I nevertheless kept falling.

Last night I had to wake up at 4:00AM for a work related matter and was feeling a bit uneasy about a conversation I had with a fellow SA member that must of struck a very deep cord within me.

I have been attending the SA meetings for the past 3 weeks, reading the literature, talking to people etc. etc.  During this time, I have not been the same person.  My head is spinning, I have had difficult concentrating and the stories that I hear every morning seem to replay themselves over again and again in my head.  I had come to SA out of the realization that I could not do it alone, but kept questioning what I had been hearing and reading at SA.

There was a fundamental question that had been bothering me that I could not get out of my head.

Step's 1 through 3 encompass the submission to Hashem, the admission of powerlessness and the turning unconditionally to Hashem as our only savior.

This seemed very easy for me to relate to as a frum jew.  After all, I davened to Hashem every day, I learned Torah, I did mitzvos.  I even felt that I performed my bein adam l'chavero in a suitable manner.  I treated my wife well, I gave my children love and spent time with them.  Step's 1 through 3 seemed like a piece of cake.  I felt as if I had them covered and would promptly move onto steps 4 - 12.

This was the question that I posed to my SA friend.

The answer that I received, however, was not what I had been expecting at all.

My friend told me that he had been struggling with step one for 2 years and it was only through years of painful relapse and almost loosing everything he had in the world (wife, family, yidishkiet) that he came to internalizing step 1.

It was his explanation and my initial misunderstanding of what he had told me that caused me to break down in tears this morning when I arose for my work and again at my morning SA meeting.

Although I do not wish to go into details, my childhood and adult years have not been easy.  Throughout all the hardship and loneliness, however, it has been my self will to rise above my situation that has enabled me to be a practicing frum jew today.

When my friend told me yesterday that a person needed to give up self will and admit powerlessness and essentially let go, I became very scared.  When I woke up this morning, I began thinking to myself how can I give up my self will.  Without self will I would not be standing among the living today.  I would be dead spiritually and would literally have nothing left.  I thought about all the struggles I had in my life.  I thought about going weeks on end without slipping and then falling once again.  I thought about dragging myself out of bed in the morning after a slip to go to shacharis and about how I literally had to force myself to go to beis medrash.  I thought about all the learning that I had done and all the personal growth I felt that I was achieving through my learning and how nonetheless I continued to fall once again.  I broke down in tears at the thought of having to part with my self will.

I went to my SA this morning and literally could not talk without crying.  I presented my personal circumstances to the group and told them I could not give up self will, because if I did I felt like I would die.

Later in the afternoon I spoke to my friend and he explained to me how I was fundamentally mistaken.

--------- will write more soon gtg .... ps: I have a point I am trying to make but the Pesach tasks await

What a story!

Dear Yosef Yaakov,

There are a few things you need to know as you start out on your journey to recovery, sobriety and new found freedom in your life. The first thing you need to know is that the phenomenon you are dealing with is not because you have huge desires and can't seem to be able to deal with them. Rather, you are dealing with a very strong sexual "addiction". It is important to understand this because, as an addiction, it can be dealt with in many tried and proven ways and methods.

We can learn from your story two important things.

1) How much Hashem desires the teshuvah of his children, even when they have fallen to the very lowest levels. He desires their teshuvah so much that he'll set the engines of an entire plane on fire. And he'll make the car not start. All to show how much he desires your teshuvah, no matter how far you have fallen. Praised is his great name!

2) We learn from this story the POWER of addiction. A person can stare death in the face, he can experience open divine miracles, but an addiction is a disease so powerful that nothing, absolutely NOTHING, can stop it.... And Hashem knew you would fall again, but he wanted you to see the power of addiction so you would finally "Hit Bottom" and admit powerlessness. And at that point you are ready for hashem to take you out of Mitzrayim. Nothing will work unless you give your life over to Hashem through the program of the 12-Steps. As "Kookoo" posted on the forum once: "I don't overcome, Hashem does it for me".

And in another place he wrote:

NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WILL CURE SEXUAL ADDICTION. ONCE AN ADDICT ALLWAYS AN ADDICT. THE ONLY OPTION IS, TO WORK THE TWELVE STEPS OF RECOVERY. A DOCTOR ONCE TOLD ME, "I HAVE TREATED MANY PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELF, NO ONE HAD CONTINUOUS SOBRIETY WITHOUT WORKING THE TWELVE STEPS.

SHOW ME ANYONE WHO IS SEXUALY SOBER FOR; 1 YEAR, 2 YEARS, 5 YEARS, 10 YEARS, 15 & 20 YEARS AND MORE, WITHOUT ANY RELAPS?

ME AND MY FIRENDS HAVE TRIED EVERYTHING, INCLUDING MEDICATION. FOR US NOTHING WORKED. THE TWELVE STEPS IS THE ONLY THING THAT WORKED AND KEEPS ON WORKING AS LONG WE WORK IT.

What you need, dear Yosef Yakov, is a true yetzias Mitzrayim. Hashem himself must take you out of the bondage of Egypt, and he can and he WILL, as long as you learn the tricks. For this, I implore you to find a 12-Step SA group in your area. And please read today's Chizuk e-mail (#450 at the very bottom of this page), I had you in mind as I prepared it.

I want to answer you more, but it is Erev Pesach. Please try to read - if you have time, the Chizuk e-mails (on that page above) starting from #440 and all the way down to #450...

Hashem knew you would fall all these years. He let this happen because he wanted more from you than just "robotic" divine service. He wanted you to give him your heart. And in the process of breaking free you will learn how to have the deepest connection with hashem.

You have come to the right place and we are here for you. Let go and Let Hashem take you out of Mitzrayim. You will yet see even greater miracles than you imagined were possible in your life!

what a story! and yes, we've ALL been through very similar happenings. #1 - dont try it on your own, you need support. on this site, you will get it. call the weekly phone groups. call the hot-line if you need it.elya is one of those people that desires to help everyone he possibly can.i never met anyone like him (yes, i've met him in person, and he didn't turn me over to the authorities). get a sponsor. call HIM (not her) whenever you feel like acting out.this addiction WILL RUIN YOUR life if you keep feeding it.you might end up in jail, or worse.some people on this forum were caught, and it ruined their life. some were never caught, but the addiction still consumed them. you DONT want to be consumed by this addiction, please, for yourself, for your family, for all of us, and above all, for Hashem's sake. it's a rough ride, but it's worth it.the rewards are enormous.to be free, not to be pulled in one direction by forces outside of yourself.pesach is about freedom, the freedom to choose the right thing and not to be controlled by ANY addiction.we are ALL with you, and i mean ALL of us. we are just like you, you are not alone!! i hate to say it again, but reb guard (what a funny name) is one of the most unique people i have EVER come across.he is devoting a HUGE part of his time for us, because he loves us and wants us to succeed.if i ever meet him, i'm going to kiss him and hug him so much he wont know what to do. jack

Welcome home to both of you.  This is a long journey you are about to embark on, but with help you can succeed.  Once you taste the ecstasy of freedom you will never want to go back.  However you have to stop to enjoy and taste the ecstasy.

This is a disease of isolation and a yearning for connection, not only to other people but also to G-d.  It is a disease of the soul.  A soul longing to fill a void, caused probably in the past by abuse, trauma, abandonment and loneliness.  the past makes no difference.  We cannot control the future.  We only have today and for today I am not going to act out in my addiction and I ask G-d to help me do that.

Matters like trauma and abuse require professional help.  Other things can be solved by working the 12 steps of SA or SLAA.  There is a wealth of knowledge on this forum and on this site and I encourage you to read everything you can. 

What you are going through is crazy, that what addiction is.... insanity.  yet we cannot stop without help and Hashem can and will help us WHEN we become a pure vessel ready and willing to accept HIS help BECAUSE we are powerless to stop.  As long as you try to control it, it will bite you.  Surrender and G-d will help you.

it wouldn't hurt to put a block on your computer either.  :D 

Just a brief update before Pesach.  B"H, I am still clean, but I have had a close call.

On Thursday night last week, I had an emission in my sleep.  In the past, this was very often the prelude to me acting out after a time of cleanliness.  This time I spoke to my wife about it and said the Tikun Haklali as well.  In previous times I would have fallen by now.  I won't say it has been easy; as the weather warms the modesty decreases.  I have been trying even harder than ever to guard my eyes.  I think it is good that I began this in the Winter.  Guarding my eyes is much more difficult in the warmer weather, and I will need every bit of practice that I have had to this point.

A kosher Pesach to everyone, and may we all know the freedom from our slavery to our addiction.

On an unrelated topic, Rabbi Wolfson is an adom gadol ad'meod.  Rabbi Wolfson is the mashgiach of Torah V'das and has a big kehillah known as Emunas Yisroel in Brooklyn.  Rabbi Wolfson is known for his in-depth study and shiurim in the area of emunah u'bitachon.  For those who are interested, you can find 24 free 1/2 hour shiurim on the topic of emunah here.  These shiurim are unrelated to Internet addiction, but are certainly inspiring and well worth the time spent listening to them.

Congrat's MD ... tizku leylech m'chayil el chayil

guardureyes wrote on 04 Apr 2009 21:32:


Omein, I never imagined that I would be focusing so intensively on Step 12 before 90 days.

I usually post dramatically but the following post will be plain and simple.

Up until yesterday I had told my wife תליט"א nothing of the true nature of my ex-addiction.

I had come up with a complicated cover-up-story in which the SA group meetings I was attending twice weekly an hour away (between travel and meeting time 3 hours total each meeting) were something like free group therapy for workaholism. The story was holding up. She was not suspicious at all and I was reluctant to disclose the truth about my ex-addiction for 2 reasons:

1) I did not want to hurt her.

2) As Rav Avigdor Miller Zt"l had said don't tell your spouse about indiscretions from your past.

However, by yesterday I saw that there was a very serious and growing problem. In the last two weeks I have been getting more and more involved in contributing ideas to an effort to B'Ezras Hashem Yisborach bring the AA/SA solution to many Frum Yidden who are currently unable to benefit. There are no words to describe the enthusiasm I have for this. This is of course B'Chasdei Hashem a wonderful thing. Except that my wife has not missed my enthusiasm, and it does not at all fit my cover story. My wife was not suspicious, but she has been totally unable to understand what has been happening to me lately.

Yesterday at the Shabbos seuda it struck me that the truth about my recovery, which I have kept secret from her, had unwittingly and increasingly become a block between us.

I decided right then and there that it seemed to me that Rav Avigdor Miller Zt"l had referred only to indiscretions from the past that had no significant impact on present behavior that could not be explained away innocently.

In my case, I had shared quite a bit with her. She knew I was going to some sort of groups. She knew that I had some form of sobriety that was at 75 days. She knew I was enthusiastic about the 12 Steps which I had shared with her, all under the guise of therapy for workaholism. However, among Frum Yidden workaholism is not the epidemic that r"l "Internet addiction" is, and since I had not disclosed my real addiction to her I had been unable to share with her the potential I saw to help so many suffering Yidden. And keeping this a secret was getting between us.

So, I told her during the Shabbos seuda that I had something to talk to her about. I spoke to her after the seuda for about 2 hours. She listened. She told me afterwards that she had just listened because she did not know what to say. But her attitude spoke louder than any words she could have said. She was very understanding and very supportive. She told me afterwards that she doesn't know if there is something wrong with her, but she is Bechasdei Hashem neither shocked, disturbed nor hurt. I told her it is because she learns musar seriously every day (without exception) that HaKodosh Boruch Hu gave her the kochos to take it all with such emuna and bitochon.

I don't deserve anything, but BeChasdei Hashem Yisborach, we are closer than we ever have been.

May Hashem bring all of us who are married, and those of us who are not yet married, closer to our spouses every day (for bochurim, this is a brocho of besho'o tovo umutzlachas), so that our marriages become, like sefer Shir Hashirim, a moshol of total faithfulness and loyalty, in both deed and in thought, so that ultimately we can all be zocheh to become truly faithful and loyal, in both deed and in thought, to HaKodosh Boruch Hu.

I updated your chart. KUTGW!




Like we wrote in Chizuk e-mail 446: "We are forced to quit playing G-d and let Hashem run our lives. We acknowledge that we are no longer in we control and give ourselves over to Hashem's care, to do with us as he sees fit. This leads to drastic life changes, not just in the area of the addiction".

May G-d be with you!

Probably neither :D Or both! My tired mind was trying to express its lack of time for the good things that it wanted to do!

So this is my 24th day nearing its end once again - and I have had some rather easy times (in terms of the addiction), and I certainly hope it stays that way! The extremely busy times have a lot to do with it: there was days where I completely "forgot" I had this addiction. Today was a little different, saw a bad picture by accident and the YH is tugging my mind even now. Though I don't give him any chances; with Hashem at my side...  8)

My life is quite muddled at the moment, have to make important choices and have to find some a summer-job: in the middle of the economy crisis - not easy. But I have learned from the second last time, and from all of you guys of course. I am (trying to) not let it bother and trust Hashem.

I am positively surprised that I have fallen "only" two times in ~80 days. Two times too much of course! BUT - compared to my 2 falls per week, or even more, before my real awakening; a  lot better. For the mathematical, thats nearly 15 times better!

Ty Guard and all the others for being here for me - and apologies for not commenting on threads of others - exams (and other things) are keeping me busy

jack wrote on 02 Apr 2009 18:16:


In mental health, confusing as it is anyway, the single word obsession, like the word compulsion has three very distinct meanings.

1) In OCD, Obsessions are intrusive and unwanted thoughts.

2) In OCPD Obsessions are an extreme pre-occupation with getting things just "right" even at the expense of the activity itself.

3) In addiction, obsession is the addict's focus on addictive and pleasurable activities, and in the process he is distracted from less pleasurable activities.

It sounds like you are referring to number 3.

Here is my own experience. I have had different types of obsessions. Some were pure indulgence, I had not lost control at all, I was perfectly capable of controling them, but lacked the motivation. That type of obsession can respond well to therapy. In a comfortable non-threatening, supportive environment you explore and get in touch with what is really going on and then wonder of wonders "all on your own" you decide to stop.

But there is another type of obsession. An obsession that has become so compulsive that you have lost control to the extent that no matter how self-aware and how determined you are, you are nevertheless totally unable to stop. In 1939 they referred to such alcoholics as "hopeless" cases.

[quote="Alcoholics Anonymous Chapter 3 More About Alcoholism p. 38][size=2]
Some of you are thinking: “Yes, what you tell is true, but it doesn’t fully apply. We admit we have some of these symptoms, but we have not gone to the extremes you fellows did, nor are we likely to, for [b][size=2]we understand ourselves so well after what you have told us that such things cannot happen again.[/b] We have not lost everything in life through drinking and we certainly do not intend to. Thanks for the information.”
      [b][size=2]That may be true of certain nonalcoholic people who, though drinking foolishly and heavily at the present time, are able to stop or moderate, because their brains and bodies have not been damaged as ours were. But the actual or potential alcoholic, with hardly any exception, will be absolutely unable to stop drinking on the basis of self-knowledge.[/b][/quote]

In my experience, at that point therapy has only one thing to offer. It can only help you see how helpless and hopeless you are and motivate you to join a 12 step program, which is what many therapists do for full blown cases of addiction.

there is one aspect of personality that i am learning about in therapy that i would like to share with the olam. i have obsessions.i think ALL addicts have obsessions.obsessions can be on anything - and they can be very harmful.where do obsessions come from, what is their source, and how do they originate? they are not present in 'normal' mentally healthy people.they come because of a problem that happened way back when.if we can learn about why we individually have these obsessions, we can fight them.that is the course i'm following right now in therapy.

dear ykv, from everything i've read here in the past 7 1/2 months, i have not been able to come up with a connection between the torah and addiction.this is noone's fault - it is MY fault for not seeing. BUT, with your explanation of the ben sorer umoreh, i think i finally have the connection i've been looking for. thank you so much.
i'm going on 7 1/2 months with one slip.i am  NOT going to say 'nida is coming - what am i going to do?' i'm going to say 'TODAY, what can i do?'
NEXT MONTH, I TURN 50!
jack

Lev Tahor,
I took the time to read all your old posts and try to understand you as much as possible.  As I read your story, tears rolled down my cheeks as I envisioned your pain.  We have all been there and we all know what it is like.  Each one of us are unique and have unique challenges, but there are common themes that run throughout.  I will try to advise as much as possible. 

I think we need to think both in the short term and long term. Short term means finding the right 'tricks' that will hold you out in the best fashion over the next few weeks.  We need to figure out what will help you day to day.  But, like you have seen for yourself an addiction is an addiction.  It keeps coming back.  To remove it from within is very difficult.  To remain abstinent and clean for 6 months is not the solution to remaining clean forever.  The spirit can reawaken.  It needs to be healed internally.  There needs to be some concrete solution that will help you in the long run. 

Long Term
Many of us on this site will attest to the fact that the real solution is not about trying harder.  It is not about constant self control.  It is not about learning how to always saying no.  All of these things are important and are necessary for growth.  But the real solution comes by changing yourself.  It comes by understanding yourself.  It comes by creating a bond with Hashem.  It comes by polishing your "Lev Tahor" and letting it shine.  There is much more to say. If you have been keeping up with the chizzuk emails you will understand better.  This all sounds so lofty and imaginative.  Is it really possible?  Are there people who have changed themselves?  The answer is Yes.  Many on this site can tell you about these changes.  But it doesn't come automatically.  It comes with work. 

But the real question is how to attain this.  The best possible solutions are either 12 step groups or actual therapy.  You mentioned that you have self esteem issues and you feel this is related to the addiction.  I know all about it.  I have been there as well.  Trying to uncover these aspects of yourself and heal them on your own is difficult.  Get help.  You said that you have already revealed this to your parents.  Kol Hakavod.  I would speak to them more about this.  They are your parents.  They can help.  And they may even encourage you to get professional help.  You spoke about your fears of getting married.  I would like to advise to solve this now.  Marriage compounds the problem even more when the guilt factor multiplies.  And addiction feeds off guilt, as crazy as that sounds.  So the issue can begin to escalate.  The self esteem issue gets bigger and the viscous cycle is set into motion.  By getting professional help and/or 12 steps you will feel better that you are actually doing something about it.  Take the time now and think this over.  Remind yourself how much you want to change.  How much you want to separate from this addiction. And remind yourself that the easiest method is getting help.  I will remind you what Guard has told you in the past, "Believe me Lev tahor, you don't want to go down the path of addiction. It's pain, pain and more pain, until life becomes unmanageable. We can help you at that stage too, but we don't want you getting there.".

Short Term
In the meantime we need tricks that will hold you over.  I would like to throw the question right back at you.  You are a smart guy. You have even proven self control in the past.  So you know yourself.  You just seem to lose touch with the true self.  So I ask you, "what do you think will work for you?"  What advice do you have for yourself?  What Gedarim should you plan on putting in place?  Do you have a bein hazmanim schedule?  What should be  your mussar sefer?  What aspects of avodas Hashem should you focus on?  What should you do to create kedusha? This is personal.  Asks yourself what you need and of course think out loud as we all read your posts.


Closing Remarks
Amongst the more perplexing commandmants in the Torah is the Mitzvah of stoning the Bein Sorer U'moreh.  We addicts can learn a lot from the bein sorer u'moreh.  The Ben Soreh U'Moreh, as we know, is a 13 year old boy who steals lots of meat and wine from his father(and mother according to some) and then eats that meat in his father property. His parents warn him and he does not listen.  He is then brought to Beis Din and is warned again.  If he continues in his evil ways he is sentenced to death.  Why?  There are lots of things wrong with this child.  He steals, has no regard for authority and he is a glutton.  But what is the root issue that the Torah sentenced him to death. The answer is ADDICTION.  He is an uncontrollable addict.  He is addicted to food in an unmanageable way. He is willing to even steal from his own parents and eat in their own house. He lost all barriers.  But still, he has not actually done anything that terrible yet.  So why kill him now.  On this the mishna states, "נדון על שם סופו", He is judged for what will be in the future.  And the Gemara brings a braisa that explains even further; He will eventually empty his father's bank account, then try to kill his father and then go out and do highway robery.  Why?  To get more money and feed his physical desires even more. Today we would call that an ADDICT

Now, the Gemara brings a machlokes as to whether this has ever happened.  Rabbi Shimon (Bar Yochai) says it never happened and is impossible to ever happen.  So why did did the Torah write it?  To learn and receive reward.  What can we learn from this.  The power of addiction.  The Torah says it will only get worse, unless there is serious intervention.  many of us on this site will tell you that first hand. Judge your present now for what can be in the future and make the right decisions.

Hi Lev Tahor,

Have you tried a 12 step program?

I would check out SA's website at sa.org for more information.

A 12 step program is by far the most consistent method of overcoming addiction, including sexual addiction.  If you are serious about changing your life, you should strongly consider looking into the SA program.  There are even many SA groups that are primarily frequented by frum jews like us.

If you need more info, please let us know.

Wow a great start and a great end to a great day.The y'h tried bur B'h failed today.I am now really starting to see how by letting go and giving myself over to hashem,I can start to se e real growth.I am at a stage in my life where I am facing up to very painful  part of my life,one that is at the root of my addiction.It is hard to face but I have the emunah that I will cut thru all the bull..... and start to live  my life.