*disclaimer LONDON and DOV I wrote this while you were writng to me*

THANKS FOR THE RESPECT IT IS DEFINATELY NOT DUE TO ME .I FEEL LIKE I AM BEING GOREM MACHLOKES.

AGAIN I AM NOT IN DEBATING MODE I AM IN STATEMENT MODE(I know that is not very humble)

I ASK FOR A BIT OF PATIENCE PLEASE HEILIGER GUARD REB DOV LONDON PLEASE BE PATIENT(i re-read all your posts)

#1 I WILL NOT DEBATE THE MERITS OR THE DE-MERITS OF 12 STEPS .IF YOU READ MY POSTS I ALWAYS SAY I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND THEM ALL I READ UP ON THE BUT I NEVER WORKED THEM I WILL NOT PASKEN ON THEM.
#2 IF IT WORKS FOR YOU GREAT MORE THAN GREAT YOU NEED TO BE DANCING FROM SIMCHA AND YOU SHOULD ALL BE PROUD .MAYBE EVEN PROUDER THAN ME BECAUSE YOU WENT THROUGH HARDER STEPS BI-RABIM TO GET HEALED
I AM REALLY BEING HONEST YOUR OPENNESS AND EXPERIENCE IS REFRESHING ESPECIALLY ON A TOPIC WHICH IS STILL LIKE SHAA LETS TALK ABOUT THIS OUTSIDE ETC..

SO GET TO THE POINT bardichev!
THHE POINT IS SIMPLE TORAH IS NOT DEBATEABLE. TORAH IS.TORAH IS THE BLUE PRINT OF THE WORLD  .TORAH IS THE MEKOR (SOURCE) OF ALL  WISDOM. TORAH IS WHERE WE FIND THE CONCEPT OF SIN THE CONCEPT OF ADDICTION THE CONEPT OF TESHUVA

TWO THINGS PRECEDED THE WORLDS CREATION TORAH AND TESHUVA

BACK TO  MY POINT. THERE IS NO WHERE IN TORAH THAT SPELLS OUT A PROGRAM FOR TESHUVA OUR RISHONIM GIVE US  A FEW
JUST BY HAVING A PROGRAM WHICH IS NOT MENTIONED IN THE TORAH DOES NOT MAKE IT UNHOLY THER ARE MANY DIVREI  RESHUS WE DO THAT ARE NOT MENTIONED IN THE TORAH

BUT WHEN DO WE MUSTER UP THE CHUTZPAH TO SAY THE TORAH DOES NOT WORK?? ( I THINK I JUST SLIPPED INTO A DEBATE SORRY)

YES THE TORAH DOES NOT SPELL OUT AN ORGANIZED SYSTEM WITH SPONSORS AND MEETINGS AND HELPFUL TIPS ALL IN ONE PLACE .I AGREE BUT DOES THAT CH"V TAKE AWAY FROM TORAH?? ( YOISH AGAIN DEBATING THAT bardichev little sneak)
TORAH IS ANIYM BIMAKOM ECHAD AHIRIM BIMAKOM ACHER. FOR THIOS VERY REASON THAT WHEN SOMEONE LEARNS A DEEP SUGYA OF TUKFO KOHEN A FEW BLATT LATER THE TORAH WANTS HIM TO HEAR SOME DIVREI MUSSAR.

YOUR PROBLEM IS NOT WITH TORAH (ah bardichev is back in the groove being meilitztov on yiddin) YOUR PROBLEM IS AND IT IS MY PROBLEM AND IT IS THE PROBLEM WITH ALL THAT  RELATES TO INYANEI KEDUSHA .THE PROBLEM IS IT IS DIFFICULT TO TEACH ,ESPECIALLY BI-RABIM AND ESPECIALLY OUR RABBIS (FOR BETTER OR WORSE) HAD NO CLUE AS HOW TO DEAL WITH THESE INYANIM AND IF THEY DID THEY DIDN'T COME ACROSS IN A NON-JUDGEMENTAL WAY.BUT THERe IS NOTHING THAT YOU WILL NOT FIND IN TORAH.

LETS TAKE ME FOR A CUTE LITTLE EXAMPLE I STRUGGLED WITH NISYONOS SINCE FIRST YEAR HIGHH SCHOOL.IT ONLY GOT WORSE AS I GOT OLDER.I HAVE RABBIEM FROM ALL ENDS OF THE SPECTRUM FROM THE KEDUHAS LEVI TO THE BAIS HALEVY AND I READ EVERY WORD IN LEV ELIYAHU AND ALMOST ALL OF IGROS CHAZON ISH AND STEPLER GAON TO ALMOST EVERY WORD OF NESIVAS SHALOM ETC.. AND I WAS STILL STRUGGLING
DOES THAT NEGATE THE KOACH OF TORAH CH"V IT IS ONLY TORAH THAT SAID bardichev keep on trucking!!!YOU WILL GET THERE

I GOT OFF TARGET IN A NUTSHELL
12 STEPS IS GOOD GEVALDIG A LIFESAVER YESS YESS YES NO QUESTIONS
TORAH IS LIFE
12 STEPS A LIFE SAVING PROGRAM CPR YES (YES LONDON I UNDERSTAND WHY A ROV CAN PASKEN TO CALL ON SHABBOS )
(BTW LONDON YOU ARE SOOO HOLY I CRY FROM TESHUVA EVERY TIME I READ YOUR POSTS)
TORAH IS LIFE TORAH IS THE ONLY ANTIDOTE TO Y"H

TALK ALL THE MERITS OF THE 12 STEPS .YOU SHOULD IT'S GOOD AND HEALTHY AND THE LAST TIME I CHECKED IT IS YOUR WEBSITE
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DON"T STEP ON THE HEILIGER TORAH

HASHIVEINU HASHEM EILECHE VINASHUVA CHADESH YAMEINU KIKEDEM!!!

very humble and yet very proud to be a  small part of this HEILIGER CHABURAH
BARDICHEV OOPS
bardichev