Hi,

I grew up in a good, large, frum family, with a hardworking father and stay-at-home-mother. I recently realized that even though I respect my parents (mostly my father) we are not close, and I was not much emotionally nurtured as a child, or now. For me, porn was (is?) more than watching pritzus; it was a way of watching women nurture men. A way of vicariously experiencing that close, feminine care.

Anyway, I want to stop. Boruch Hashem, I am 21 days in, and so far so good. There have been easier and harder days, and I have been counting fifferent things; in the beginning it was just watching porn leading to masturbation, but I didn't count pictures that didn't lead to masturbation. Now, I have so far been out of that too, and things have been much better; and easier.

I have lots of shame surrounding porn and masturbation. I saw that sort of thing for the first time when I was twelve, and I was terrified my parents would find out. I could not get the images out of my head, and I still remember it. I walked around both with the thrill and the fear for months and months after, with no one to talk to. I was scared I would never be able to focus on davening again, etc. At some point, I got a phone and was able to see porn pictures on it. I went for years without porn, when I was in yeshiva etc., but when I had the opportunity again it would swing back.

There was a time I was very careful with shmiras einayim, taking off my glasses in the street and that kind of thing. Eventually, I got a smartphone and that was that. I went through the TAG phase, filters on and off, for me the filter itself has been a trigger. I got engaged and eventually the girl broke it off because she felt I was not frum enough for her, and I felt so much shame, especially since I thought we were in love together. 

Anyway, Boruch Hashem, I got married to a wonderful girl and we have children, and I am trying to get clean for real this time.

My motivations for wanting to stop watching porn and masturbation (especially porn, but both, sure):
1. I do not want to lose control of myself. I want to make my own decisions
2. It feels so unclassy and unposh
3. I want to be a role model for my sons
4. I want to be back in the "game" of Avoda, in a way that is really meaningful and significant
5. I want to have intimacy with my wife where I am not dissociative
6. I want to feel love for my wife and children
7. I do not want to feel so much guilt, shame, and two-faced 
8. I want to experience adulthood like an adult
9. I want to help others through this challenge
10. I want to serve the Eibeshter with כל עצמותי

I am thinking to use this thread as a place to write my thoughts of the day, to let them out and not hurt me.

Beautiful post! Thank you for sharing! I felt a sting reading some of the stuff you went threw  and the heavy packages you seem to be holding in your heart. 

May you see much success in this journey!

Wow such a nice post!

Heart-warming vulnerability and honesty.

Looking forward to reading more posts!

IYH it will help you keep up and expand your good work and your motivation, and serve to educate and inspire other as well.

There's a lot of depth in much of what you write, friend.
You articulate deep understanding that our struggles affect us and hold us back in experiencing true Chayim in so many areas.
Love for children, adult living, so much more.
You want כל עצמותי תאמרנה .
I think that you have the Kochos and connection to real Chayim that it takes to get there, and get there you will, IMYH.

Welcome, looking forward to seeing more of you.

Thank you each, the support is helping me greatly!
Ok so here is some more, I started enjoying cuddling with my wife more, and my children. It almost brings me to tears. I keep on crying to the song ואני קרבת אלקים לי טוב. The days have been passing by terminably, and I'm finishing up day 21 now, הודו לה'. I have been visiting GYE pretty much every day several times, texting someone at least one daily, sometimes phone calls; the inyan has become my project.

I have tried stopping I cannot tell you how many times, I am sure many of us have. But this time feels different for two reasons:
1. This time I have support, from you guys, and from my wife.
2. I am not working on this out of force or pressure (how could you still be doing this- you're a ben torah, father, husband, in your thirties...). This time, I want to stop. 

This time, I have actually sat down quickly and organized why I want to stop. I probably should add, if I didn't before, that I am excited and apprehensive to meet the new me who comes through this process. I do not feel emotional pressure right now, I feel more intellectual pressure, and maybe a sense of maturity (I've begun thinking, do you want to get old and still be watching porn? "C'mon, old men don't do that; surely I'll stop by then". "Hang on, do thirty year olds watch porn? No, but here you are anyway. So what would stop you watching porn when you are old and gray?" And what if you happen to die sooner; I do not want to die without regaining control over my choices". 

Unrelated: One of the tzaddikim of gye called me to work on a time to meet, and my wife saw the caller ID, and asked who that is, so I told her, and she said why is he calling, so I told her, and she got weirded out- "why does he want to meet you?" L'maase, this is one of those things I need to do for myself (gain sobriety, composure, class, maturity, free will, love, gracefulness, self confidence, a feeling of worth), and even if she doesn't understand it, I need to do what I think is right. For her, it seems to feel (I didn't get a chance to ask her yet) like someone is intruding on my life; I need to explain that I am serious about change, and am willing to do uncomfortable things for that, like go on GYE, expose myself in some way, talk to people, meet them, take on kabalos etc. 

I am a little nervous that I haven't had crazy urges yet, at least since I have ruled out even still images, and have begun trying not to look in the street, and so on. I do not know what I will do when I get those urges. The other day, I told my wife I was feeling pressure in my lower half, and that helped me calm down a little bit, because I was able to express it, and that made her feel good and wanted, too (timing just wasn't right, smack in the morning with kids around), so that was great.

Actually, I think I will print out my list of motivations, and put it in my wallet, with a kabbala that if a crazy urge comes I will first do three things:
1. Read the list, out loud, carefully, and with feeling.
2. Tell my wife (where appropriate).
3. Call or text one of the mentors here.

Even as I write this, a voice inmy head says, don't make this an official kabbala, maybe you won't be able to keep it. And even as I write the last sentence the voice came back and said "no, really, I mean it". And I know it may sound pathetic, but I am keeping it like a not-so-firm kabbala for the moment.

Having this venue to document my thoughts is such a wonderful gift. Thank you.

Beautiful Beautiful. I love this post.

I will raise the point that involving your wife with al, details and every urge, fall, slip and success, might be counter productive. And also unfair to her.

Keep it up buddy, step by step, KOT!

Sapy wrote on 24 May 2023 02:26:

about the wife, yeah for sure- I mean when I am in the mood for sex, if I tell her she feels good, so we both feel good and close about wanting to be together even if we cant- I wouldnt tell her im in the mood for porn, or if i slipped- good point

My daily bedtime is 11 pm. If I make it on time for a week, I can get myself a new book or something. I made this system to encourage myself to get to bed early; this way I don't spend my time on porn, snacking, and getting tired the next day. Last night I kept my eye on the clock, and spoke to one of the yidden here a little past 11. I decided its ok (still not going to get the book), but then there was the issue of "am I going to watch a geshmake interview on youtube now, have a snack, or go to bed?" I decided to just go to bed. Then I went to the bathroom and decided not to take my phone with me (thats hard for me). Then I went to bed, and decided to leave my phone on the dresser (also hard for me). This morning I woke up on my back and decided not to turn over to my stomach (was a bit difficult). 

Part of what day counting, GYE, and keeping in touch has done for me is it is encouraging me to try new things that are uncomfortable. I used to try new things all the time (learning through the night b'ritzifus, serious shmiras einayim, learn through large sefarim), but lately, maybe an age thing, but I havent had the same stamina or will to take on small things like the ones mentioned earlier. Now, I am feeling it more. Its all part of the inyan of not only wanting to be on the other side, but willing to go through the small fights to get there.

Great stuff, dovberyl. Really great stuff.

Regarding not having real urges yet, unfortunately you don't have to worry about it. They will come, mark my words. I find this is common many times when I start(ed - hopefully) again with a new strategy or twist, or I see a new member join in a serious way, as you are.

The excitement of having a new life tangible, where we feel we will finally gain control over these unwanted desires and drives for once and for all, offers a grace period where we are going above and beyond, and the mere thought of failing is almost laughable. 

It doesn't last. But - it doesn't have to. It can be used to build a strong foundation that can weather the storms when the excitement fades. If used properly, as you clearly seem to be doing, it can be a beautiful gift that will assist you in achieving your long term, life changing goals.

I'm not attempting to discourage you. On the contrary, if you are prepared then it will be easier to overcome. When one gets all comfortable with quieter urges and then unexpectedly gets hit by a tidal wave, it can be overwhelming, amd frustrating that the strategies aren't working etc. but not if prepared. 

Keep shteiging!

Dovberyl, just read through your stuff, GEVALDIG!!! I loved every word.
You show true understanding, you are so thought out, and it is very inspiring to me to read your thoughtful words. It especially important that you have a game plan. Keep up the amazing work, keep sharing, inspiring and, of course, trucking!
I will admit that there was one thing that bothered me. Why would think that anything you write is pathetic? My friend, chin up! We are your brothers here, we have all been there done that, we love to hear from you and all our friends and brothers. Don't put down one of my brothers, ok?

Eerie wrote on 24 May 2023 18:13:

Thank you all so much! The responses are so meaningful to me. I am not so used to people caring about what I say and think, sometimes I may be awkward about it (too many thank yous, or not enough). Thank you so much for the support.

Today I felt some complacency, which made me scared. I was mischazek to do more hard work on the flight to freedom program- work that I have been putting off because it is kind of arduous, but I did it; not perfectly, but good enough for a start. We're not letting perfection be the enemy of the good, for now. Got a shtikel annoyed at the wife in the morning for not timekeeping with my schedule but I breathed it through. I had a busy morning, including a therapy session, where the guy came late and I got annoyed at him, and told him so; got over myself to say what I was thinking instead of having a whole session marred by constant thoughts of "you don't care enough to show you care". Took care of a bunch of things I have been putting off.

Later, read my motivations with "gefeel" to get myself in the right frame of mind. Told myself "you're a good guy" and smiled, a couple of times. When I came home at night, my wife was under stress from kitchen stuff. I had work to do, but offered her to do the dishes while she finished other things, and she said that's the nicest thing ever. I often help, but this was a bigger deal (cheesecake vechulu). In the past, sometimes I have helped out of a sense of guilt over my porn habit (without having mentioned it to her yet), but now I wanted to help. As I was washing she made a comment about how I was doing it, and instead of getting upset I gently told her I didn't offer to help to get her as a mashgiach on it. We had a great night, at least she did I tried not to get ticked off that she was dressed too casually (read: carelessly) for my taste. 

I used to often feel it's not fair that Avraham Avinu did a small thing with the malachim to bring them water, and as a result the Jews got water the whole time in the Midbar etc. And Eglon stood up and was zoche to Rus, and Nevuchadnetzar had his zchus for taking three steps. Harei, we bring water, we stand a whole shmone esrei, we take three steps back, and eternity does not give a hoot. There will never be a pasuk praising us for it, Mashiach won't come from us bezchus that (you never know, I guess). It feels like with all our work we will not get the recognition of Yosef, Boaz or Paltiel etc.

But I learned a Midrash today - רות רבה ה,ו--- לשעבר היה אדם עושה מצוה והנביא כותבה, ועכשיו כשאדם עושה מצוה מי כותבה, אליהו כותבה ומלך המשיח והקדוש ברוך הוא חותם על ידיהם, הדא הוא דכתיב (מלאכי ג, טז): אז נדברו יראי ה' איש אל רעהו וגו'.

General Grant, sir. This landed with a thud, right where I needed it. Thank you

Dovberl, agree with you . I feel that we are growing together in our concurrent journeys.
Learning each one of your posts and feeling your Heartz

This medrash is one of my personal Chizzukim.
Also אילו ידע ראובן וכו׳
Chazal tell us that if we would have idea how each of our efforts make a Roshem and are recorded in Shamayim...
Chazak ViAmatz, Chaver