Partly why my defences were down coz I was very tired
I plodded on to a meeting and made sure to say Something and from there to yeshiva.
Once the learning kicked in it was gishmack BH 
off to bed feeling a little safer
but really gotta work on those surrender muscles
the unmanageability and all, problem is that when in the rut the unmanageability is there too..
Sponsor doesnt have his step into action - so hopefully will get more direction tomorrow on step 2

OK
Went to the therapist and basically she gave a moshol
Women are like a pot of water, it takes a long time till it boils, but then stays hot for a long time after
Men are like a match - get lit up fast and goes down fast
Won't go into the nitty gritty of the nimshal but she said if the wife is already at boiling point, more intimacy will just make the water spill over...
The trick it to actually heat up the water of course... - which is basically the good feeling [in her heart] the wife wants to get from her husband.
Once the pot is hot then intimacy can make it boil to its zenith.
BH she determined that our shalom bayis is on par and I'm keeping her at boiling point all week long so no need for intimacy on her part, [unless I want the water to bubble over]
However she was of the opinion that intimacy although optional is still a man's need and not to be disregarded. 
This is of course tricky, and although heartwarming also a little disappointing. I will have to internalize this wonderful fact and reassess my situation!!
I will have to learn how to regulate myself as the therapist promised me that unless I stop giving my wife the TLC that I currently am giving she will feel "full" and not need intimacy [spoiler - she didn't recommend that I do so :) ] 
However me being male have different needs and process love differently.
I suppose I initiate a DMC with the rebbetzin and work something out IYH
[Posted more detail on BB forum[url=https://gye.nu/forum/17-Balei-Battims-Forum/407876-Abstinence-in-the-bedroom?limit=15&start=15#414592] gye.nu/forum/17-Balei-Battims-Forum/407876-Abstinence-in-the-bedroom?limit=15&start=15#414592[/url]]
Any ideas welcome  on BB forum or in PM
Just for today!

Missing my daily check-ins
Been very hectic BH
Davend last night @ the Kosel [ער"ח סיון] for all you GYE's [and my kids and my sobriety etc]
 lust is still lingering - secretly hoping that 'something' will happen
BH Haven't contacted that woman again - seems she's lost interest in me     [think she's pissed off that I'm no chasing her anymore...]
Hoping to conform with wife fixed times for intimacy, its gonna be a challenge for her, but will IYH be better for US.
I might leave yeshia early on the weeknight we are together.
Yeshiva wanted me to join them for shabbos, wife didnt want, said no and wasn't Codependent on 1] the feeling of disappointing them 2] the fear that they will now never honour me again...
Would never have happened 2 years ago. I would have let wife know the program period! 
DIdn't let lust distract me @ the kosel BH, kept focused on my mission, was present and connected.
Rightee-o

OK 
So its a cycle today, lusting so no cheshek, out of sync so feel yucky so wanna fix to cure that yucky feeling. Know that a fix won't fix anything s don't act out, but wait and hope for that Big Bang [pun unintended] to make the yucky feeling 'worthwhile'. In the interim not found anything [and not looking too hard - coz I dont REALLY wanna do it...
Noticed feeling guilty inside and tried to buy something for wife subconsciously - That means at least subconsciously i'm aware that its cheating and are trying 'to make it up to her'
Quite impressive! 

BH not oogling in the street, [ie looking at women for their beauty, effectively a shmiras einayim issue and objectifying and using them]  but definitely on the lookout for a girl who I can approach [of course there aren't any!]

parev wrote on 06 Jun 2024 15:48:

Cool! You're summing them up and rating them in your mind, without lusting or ogling! Can you teach me how to do that? Sounds like a win-win.

Sorry for the sarcasm, But you may need to rethink the definition of lusting. Summing up girls for their level of approachability, sounds pretty darn much like lusting to me.

@Redfaced reworded my post
feel free to comment though

Dont see any difference - but 
parev wrote on Unknown:

parev wrote on 06 Jun 2024 15:48:

So this is something I've been wondering about. Spurred on by amavekesh's post as well. 

For someone who is struggling with more than bog-standard shmiras einayim, is it possible and/or beneficial for them to progress in shmiras einayim while they are still struggling with lust? Are lust and shmiras einayim inexorably intertwined?

It sounds like R' Parve would say of course lust and shmiras einayim don't go hand in hand, and it's not farcical to guard your eyes while actively lusting.
I think many on here would disagree, and say that shmiras einayim is tied together so intimately with lust that the lust must be cured for any real and meaningful progress with shmiras einayim.

Obviously, just because someone has one issue doesn't mean they can't work on another, and just because someone's sinning/struggling/sick with something doesn't mean they should give in to every little aspect of that problem until they are totally cured. That's ludicrous.
And of course, it "makes Hashem happy" if you guard your eyes even for moment, even if you then spend two hours having sex with yourself (or someone else). And growth doesn't have to happen evenly.

I don't think I was clear on most of what I was trying to say.
But I guess if I had to try to channel some of the grumpy old fogies on the site for a minute, I'd say that viewing levels of shmiras einayim as progress while you are still lusting the same amount is just using Gods rules as an excuse for lying to yourself. And until you stop lying to yourself you won't be able to get better.

chosemyshem wrote on 06 Jun 2024 17:36:

I just didnt understand how a person can avoid ogling while also rating girls. I would have a difficult time using my potions scale if im not actively looking at it. 
Even if  lust and shmiras einayim are not inexorably intertwined. Rating (A) = ogling ( B ) = lusting (C) . And therefore rating (A) = lusting (C)

Shmiras einayim is guarding your eyes
I would think that guarding your mind is on par

What are we calling lust?

Oל חודא אם בךקשר איק שןר
I איןמל I 'שד /וןאק קספךןבןא אישא I שצ ךודאןמע שךםא רקבקמאךט 'שןאןמע כםר ש נןע נשמע

HHOWEVER ןא דגםקדמא צקשמ אישא ןאד שךך ןםר מםאיןמע מ איןד עשצק
Sשט כםר קסשצפךק דםצקםמק 'יק ןד SSA ישד יןד םעעךןמע ן איק צןלהש ומגקר בםמארםךת נוא מםא 'יק ןמ אןצקד ד/ושרק
Just notice typing in hebrew
gonna send it anyway incase someone has the thingy that trasilitiates it

2] i am not rating girls. just up to notice someone who is in a flirty mood. If you don't chap its ok

parev wrote on 06 Jun 2024 17:55:

So you haven't turned your eyes loose but you feel a desire to interact with someone who is also looking for some of your attention?

I think there is benefit to not looking and that working on shmiras einayim first should help someone to work on lust.

Had the long awaited DMC
Went down well BH we are setting fixed times- my lust part isn't to happy about that, but hey were not here to lust anymore.
Definitely put a new perspective on things, and I discovered that things that I thought I was doing all these years 'one sided' my wife very much enjoyed but never expressed it.
WOMEN!
[OK men need to learn how to mind read]

great sober shabbos 
intimacy was as good as expected BH from all angles
wasted some time but at least let wife then

Dןדבםהקרג ש מק' ארןעעקר - מםא כקךןמע עםםג 'ןאי צט דקךכ נקבשודק םכאןצק צןדצשמשעצקמאץץץ
Wשד יםפןמע ד,דםצאיןמע, 'םוךג ישפפקמ אםגשטת כקקך ךןלק ש גרט גרומלתחודא ש ךןאאךק נןא נקאאקר נקבשודק I שא ךקשדא דוררקמגקג עםןמע אם אקך שהןהץץץ
I hate it when this happens...
Too bad\והמבין יבין....