lookingforwardtochange wrote on 08 Aug 2012 22:41:


First of all, I don't know any short words.

Praying for them is not the first defense weapon I would suggest, as I have tried to say before. The first tool is to just gently (not strongly and intensely) close my eyes. Simple. Then I turn my head the way it was facing before I noticed the image of her great figure...and get back to real life with thanks on my lips to Tatty.

Now, if you still deep down inside you really believe that real life is through using the image of her figure...then this will need a lot more help. Like talking over with others my behaviors openly and honestly, just to let them go, as R' Elimelech of Liszhensk zy"a wrote to non-addicts in his Tzet'l Kotton over 200 years ago. That will take honesty, time, and patience, be"H.

So what does it do for me to daven for her? It changes her for me into a real person. It is easy to lust over a plastic doll of a perfect naked woman. It is easy to lust over a women who I imagine is just for sex - that all she wants is sex - that I imagine has no humanity, tzoress, needs, fears, shameful weaknesses, etc...she is a sex machine for me. She is not human, really...well, she is fohrt a goy! - or is a frayeh yideneh so oichet she's not a real person for me! So I can use her.

And looking down at them (shiksah, pritzusdikeh, etc.) and despising them is not the way to 'beat the yetzer' - at least not for one who is already worshipping them! First of all it is dishonest - for he really worships her and her great body, so he is lying and collecting Yiddishkeit together with his lies. And besides, putting other people down is stoopping to the derech of ra - evil, of making certain people into 'vermin' - like Nazi's ym"s did: real people are only Aryans - Jews are just vermin...or like the Muslims do: real people are just muslims - Jews are from pigs and dogs the Kor'an says. Nu. No wonder these cultures have so much sex slaves in their people. They do. Look at Osama - you know, every time the US kills a muslim cleric or terrorist, what do they find in their houses? Huge porn video stashes! Their supremacy mindset sets women up as inferior class, subhuman, so they use them like dolls.

That is the way you want to be? No, of course not.

So the opposite of that is pray for them - for their well-being. Care for them by not abusing their image, by not treating them the way this western culture (that manufactures all the porn) wants to make them consider themselves by the latest fashions...don't give in to the lie! They are people, too. Real people like you and me. Choviv Odom is even for a goy - Chavivin Yisroel is for us. But the goy is the one Hashem did most of the ten makkos for! What, He couldn't just take us out right away? But He said it, not me: veyad'oo mitzrayim ki eyn kamoni bkerev ho'oretz, etc... They are different than us, but do matter in some way to Him. They are real. She is real. Not an object. Even a goy from some foreign country.

And my wife is not a chaticha neveilah, either, you know. But the sickness wants me to misunderstand the RMB"M (you know so well which I mean) and treat her like a piece of meat! No.

Anything we do that is the opposite of that is helping us.

Now, I am not saying to go and give her a hug and tell her you love her so much that you will not abuse her image. Of course there is real love - and that is treating them the way Hashem wants us to treat them. But a frequent abuser and user of them for sex pleasure by staring at them like all of us have done for years - such a person needs to take an extra step in the distancing from them - and an extra step in anti-lust: Love. To love every beryah appropriately. The chazir by not eating it, the goyteh by not staring at her and not asking Hashem to help her reach her tachlis, the Jewish woman by asking basically the same thing...get my point?

I am not interested in any more philosophy.

Sorry I was not at all bekitzur.

Did that help you? Can you do it? Or do you need to understand it even better before you use it and be"H get better? You are entitled. But is that what you need?

dov wrote on 08 Aug 2012 23:22:

Sorry for interrupting, but is this true? Did they find a huge porn stash down at Osama's place?

Take it EZ, TZ. You sound like you're ready to head over to Pakistan.

And remember even if they found..., it's not your problem. It 'was' his problem. Now it's nobody's problem, I guess.

MT

Thanks DOV for clarifying, Now i will try to explain it in short words and you tell me if im correct.

When we see a immodestly dressed or just any women and lust starts. by praying for them we automatically do 2 things:
1. We move our thoughts to good things, by instead of thinking about her physical look , we think about her emotional needs,
2. By praying for them we look at them as real human beings and not sex objects.

It make a lot of sense, will try to practice it, and will let you know how it works.

Thanks again!!!!

TehillimZugger wrote on 09 Aug 2012 09:19:

Yes, they did. The Wall Street Journal ran a story about the entire operation and the writer mentioned the schmutz derech agav. Of course (since I am such a groiseh goodie-goodie) it got my attention right away so i remembered it in my sefer zichronos.

Nu. But if it matters that much to you and you don't want to take my word for it, I am sure you could find the nice guy's entire stash displayed as, umm, 'evidence', on youtube yemach sh'mo. Hahahahah!!

;D

(emoticons are fun)

8)

dov wrote on 10 Aug 2012 00:07:

Todah Lakel I CAN"T find anything on youtube, because I'm "goodie goodie" enough to search for it...