i cant say there werent times of weakness i didnt try to find holes in the filter, but i thought to myself after a bit "is it worth it?" and either i would give up or would find a pathetic fix, i.e. a picture of a women in a bikini through google image search, but then i would be disgust and close it quickly. I am sick of the cycle, but the filter and rules i set for myself limiting my internet use, really helped.
I would be interested in what you have to tell me, assuming it isnt the GYE handbook, which i did read.

danagar wrote on 15 Jun 2011 14:15:



The filters do help. Don't get me wrong. They help you see what a life without this addiction is like, and they help a healthy person from obstacles, kinda like the guard rail on the highway. Doing the 90 day challenge chart is also helpful in this way, plus it shows you what potential Hashem planted inside of you. What has worked for me is working with Duvid Chaim's phone conferences and working with the tools that have worked for him and loads of people faced with addiction. While I wish there was a system in Torah that was being used in an organized fashion and has been proven to work like the  12 step program has, it seems this is the absolute most effective program available. The Torah certainly has all these principles in it, but it's hard for many with this burning temptation to commit to a program that's not organized and shows no convincing proof of success. That's a horrible thing to say about Hashem's Torah, but it has been my experience that the 12 steps are actually Torah teachings translated into the language of addictive thinkers. Torah means "guidance," Hashem's guidance, His will for our lives, and that's what the 12 step program is all about discovering -- what is His will, how will it fill the void that I've been stuffing with trash all this time, and how do I pick myself up and surrender to that Will.

Did anyone here read this?

Jooboy wrote on 15 Jun 2011 02:23:
It works wonders if you can actually mean it. If you do not buy it yet at all, and/or are just too emotionally tied to the romance of 'beating their YH'. If you are not an addict and really do have the ability to stay clean without a miracle, then I genuinely say "more power to you, bro!". But if you really feel you are powerless based on your pathetic track record, then why is it so hard for many to consider what works for the alcohol and heroin addicts? One answer: it is honorable to be 'a valiant struggler for Hashem against the YH' - but ignomious to be a pathetic loser to lust like I am and really give Hashem all the credit for loving me enough to free me on a daily basis. It just hurts too much to see that we are actually 'worse' ,in some way, than all the truly normal guys out there who can struggle with occasional porn use and masturbation and yet be OK emotionally and have lives that still work - and get schar for fighting the good fight! An addict like me ain't like that - we eventually fall apart worse and worse and find cannot "control and use" the schmutz for fun. Eventually, it just isn't fun any more - it messes with our heads, we overdo it, and cannot remain ovdei Hashem because - unlike normal people - we live double lives as a result of partaking. We obsess about it. It's like Hotel California, for us. "You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave!" For people like me there is simply no way to successfully use lust, period. We try, we bargain with it, with Hashem, with ourselves for years and years. Pfft!

Look out: And behind the romance with being a 'tzaddik', lays this dirty secret that really stops people from using what might really work: they are afraid to really give it up, cuz it hurts way too much to lose our precious, sweet porn that does for us what nothing else can. Not avodas Hashem, not good living, not learning Torah, nothing. It's simply the best feeling we can imagine. So we are deathly afraid to give it up, aren't we? I was, till it hurt too much (or 'enough'). Sure, there is deep religious feeling to stop doing these terrible aveiros...but it didn't consistently work for me nor for the addicts who I know, and we just kept getting slowly worse R"l.

Everybody has their right time, when it gets just too hard inside to continue with the old romance with the 'sin' model. That model will work for most people, I believe, but for those who are actually addicts, it won't. And the others will go to great lengths to convince them that it should - that is has to. I see that as cruelty. That's why I am here.

Hi there! 

hi danagar,it is amazing of you to bring your private battles out here,and not take your your little fling with your yetzer hara to your bednoom and lock the door.And tell yourself I am fine it was just a slip no big deal; why should I tell anyone.Now let's think a little, what does your yetzer hara want?how has he had success with you before?How did he get you to fall this time?Is there some sort of cycle that keeps happening over and over?

I find that doing what I did as a child whenever I was ill helps. Let me explain: Whenever I was ill I would be put on the sofa with plenty of liquid drinks, the tv would be on ( I was normally banned from daytime tv) and I would have a pile of books and comics. Clearly I don't do that anymore, but I do read books (try "Mans Search For Meaning" by Victor Frankl) . Watch comedy tv/dvds, it will take you away from the thoughts. Works for me.

Kvetched

kvetched wrote on 19 Jun 2011 08:56:


In all honesty and with all due respect, "Kvetched", your message above makes it sound to me that you are dealing with "breaking a bad habit", and not with an addiction.

Yet before, you shared:




Not trying to pry, for I am not curious at all...but just asking honestly:

Was your divorce related to your lust behaviors such as porning, masturbation or acting out in any other way? Or was the lust problem completely peripheral to why the two of you had to break up?

Thanks,

Dov

The divorce was quite unrelated to it, moreover it was the stress of having to attend court, travelling several hours to do so and the unknown outcome that pushed me over the edge. In the end the divorce was easy though at the time I was a wreck.

My previous answer was mearly to change a sudden mindset, not to break an addiction nor even a habit, mearly a tool to shut off an urge.

Understood. Thanks for clarifying that (even though I have no right to know).

Have you ever described to anyone in detail exactly what you do when you act out your urges and what you did during its progression from the very first time through till the very last time? In writing all that out on paper, you may discover quite a few things you have not yey figured out and do not expect.

Hmmmm, tough one Dov. I suppose, for me, it is a sort of "collecting process", I will collect a lot of "soft" images for no reason over a short (usually stressful period) only to delete them eventually in a state of guilt. I don't do anything with or to them, just collect. It sounds so strange typing this now as I feel sort of childish about it. I have done this for about 8 years on and off and when on my own.

The guilt on having a "collection" then kicks in (this usually happens as any stress is going) and I delete the collection.

I don't use chat sites nor would I ever think of ever meeting anyone. I just seem to have collected images short term for no real reason!!!!!!!!

...and do you masturbate to any of these images? Or is it just 'there' like money in the bank?

By the way, when you sense the fact that 'it feels weird' to type out the truth about yourself in all its awkward simplicity, you are stumbling on the power that AA's refer to when they say "we are only as sick as our secrets". There is freedom in opening up, and the more open we are (with safe people) the freer we become. The more we hide the truth behind lies, behind fake names (aka usernames , and virtual persona like here on GYE), the more we remain in the same state. We actually hide it in order to protect it, so we will still be able to face doing it.

Its the "money in the bank" syndrome, though there is a sort of "pent up" feeling/emotion which I can't quite verbailize. I have a truly beautiful partner and we share a very very good love life, in fact it is the best one can imagine. I seem to fall back on this learn't "collecting" thing and am trying to break it. You have done much already Dov to get me to get this "on paper" which is the first time I have actually done this.
I soon undertake a very important new job,which requires a huge input of my time/brain. I know it will be stressfull and as yet the financial part of my divorce is on-going....more stress, but I am managing it and talking to my partner.

Whatever is going on with your relationship with your new (I assume rather new) partner, I wish you hatzlocha in finding what is right and connects you to Hashem and to the people in your life more and more honestly, one day at a time.

All the best with your new job, and may your ex have a nechoma, whatever the situation was and is.

Bless you Dov.

Got a copy of "the 12 jewish steps to recovery" today. Had a good day today, it was a busy one with work lasting from 8am until 6.30pm ending on a very intense,though interesting, meeting. Feel I need a break, even if it just a couple of days. A change of scenary and routine is appealing to me so I can reflect on life away from the daily grind. Does this make sense?

No thoughts of being lured back. Just a sense of self loathing, nothing major, just a slight feeling of it. I tend to look at other people and wonder if they too have "issues" with things? Perhaps I am feeling odd or strange at present??????

i have such a urge now to watch, my wife is not home, and iam just a minute away. can anyone help me with a eitzah to hold back