If you are needing 'something different', and believe that you are an addict, then have you considered live (real) meetings? Is that just 'too different'?

You posted that you have discovered that you are an alkie. Are you going to AA meetings? I guess you are, but it doesn't hurt to ask...

So if you are, then SA meetings are the same. I'm not an alkie but I go to AA meetings, too sometimes. I'd love to drive you to a geshmak live meeting so that you can let-er rrripp!

It sounds like your story is somewhat like mine - and the stuff you have in your back pocket may qualify you...it all depends on what you want and what works for you. Hatzlocha with whatever you do and if you ever want to try something else, look me up.

I tried the phone in last night - 10:20 PM EST?  Nobody was there so left.  Anyhow another nisayon, I'll get there.
yes indeed I'm a proud alkie... meetings for a few months.
Funny you should talk about back pockets Dov ... I had an ipod shuffle in my back pocket with Breslov shiurim... ;-)
Anyhow going to try the phone ins again... I think there is one now...

The 8:30 AM, 12:00 PM, & 10:20 PM (Eastern Time) 12 Step Phone Conference Calls are scheduled to restart on May 16th.

You beat me to it YH!

You can see a schedule for all the calls here - spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkadOYxt3aROdHE2R1pXaHE1YjkzX0pwbVNaN2VHUVE&hl=en#gid=0

As you'll see on the schedule there's a few other calls running at this time, but the 3 calls I have had personal experience and success with begin May 16th as YH said (before I had a chance!!)

YVY

Like yosef was a mashbir and had plent of money all in the zechus of keeping in line with the chat heyedia so too all who try in this will become rich. This should help if you are in a line i have seen it work.

dov wrote on 02 May 2011 15:32:


Dov, please explain this a little more.  I can't do it.  But it's so hard to connect with Hashem.  He's there, yes.  But staying sober both in deed and in thought requires CONSTANT awareness of Him.  I ask him all day to please take over, I am powerless, I cannot do it, You Hashem, You put these thoughts in my head so You deal with them.  Please.  And yet as the weather warms up, my brain still interprets what the eye sees as a lust trigger.  The more I look down and take off my glasses, the more I wonder what's going on "out there" while I'm in my dark room.  That's not right either.

I'll let Dov answer for himself, but my experience has been that the 1st step of feeling you're absolutely powerless is crucial and if you're not completely there yet, it sounds like you're on the way to internalizing that fact. However, the process of letting G-d into your life does not stop there for most. I imagine there are some who just feel powerless and the rest is smooth sailing with G-d. Most others, I believe need to continue through the steps of living with G-d's help. Build up the willingness to have Him restore your sanity. Clean out all the junk that's been obscuring your vision of Him. Devote yourself to following His will. Take steps to insure that you stay on this Derech. That, to me, is the 12 steps in plain English (besides that "derech" lapse...). Does it ring true for you?

aaron4 wrote on 04 May 2011 14:44:


No, it does not require one to be "CONSTANTLY aware of His presence", and it certainly is attainable just as easily for goyim - even non-religious goyim - as it is for a frum yid. I know many of those who 'have it'. So let's start there. This pekkle is not a heavy one to carry. But I have to admit that I have been speaking to Him and more aware of Him as the years go on, for that is the result of these steps and this recovery. I talk to Hashem many times over the course of the day, and I only rarely 'try hard' in davening. He knows exactly what to do for me, anyhow. It won't help if I act constipated, you know, nor if I shukkle especially hard. All of that stuff is plain nonsense.

But my question to you is this: Who (I mean of people) are you doing all this with?

Just w/yourself alone?

Just me, Dov.  Alone.

I did phone in at lunch the other day, there were a couple of people, I didn't say anything as I had to go, but it sounds like the big groups will start up again in 10 days.  I recently went to an AA meeting and discovered that some AA folks are indeed SA folks... and I did hear about SA meetings, and to be honest I'm not eager on going to live SA meetings... just like I'm not eager on going into churches for AA meetings.  I mean I'll do what I have to, I just heard from the SA meetings that there are some folks there who have some pretty wild pasts, and also the discussions can involve details of doing things that I haven't yet imagined (or have imagined, but didn't realize people actually did them and that it was part of addiction!!)

In an SA meeting, if someone is ever sharing something that you find triggering, all you need to do is raise your hand and the secretary member of the meeting will ask him to stop and go onto something else that is not so triggering.

Nu. But who says SA meetings are what you need, at all?

(They save my life, but I can ask that, no? They are certainly not for everybody.)

I guess maybe SA meetings are indeed not for everyone.  So back to the telephone chat lines.  It really is just craziness.  Looking forward tot he renewal of the programme on May 16th.  The dialogue in my head is just annoying now...

Edge,

Did you make it to the calls today? I listened in but didn't get to check in at 12 -- only at the 8:30 one. I hope to hear from you!

YVY

So if the calls do not work after a few months and you have not gotten the relief that you seek, then what? Are you willing to go to any lengths to get and stay clean one day at a time, or is this not really bothering you that much? Only time will tell. And that is the same for me, you, and everybody else.

I am not being crabby, but just trying to say that I have heard so many excuses from guys for why in-person meetings are not really necessary (and they may be correct about that!) - but when no other option was working, they still didn't go. And that proves to me that the only reason they were not choosing to go always was only one: They didn't want to because they wanted to be able to keep looking at porn and masturbating.

And being a powerless addict, I cannot blame them in the least. I'd never have stopped if I didn't have to. I just couldn't go on any more...

Hatzlocha with the calls!! I love you, brother!

lack of discipline.  I didn't diarize it properly.  Yesterday was a write off.  I need to put a reminder in my calendar to call in.  It's only been a few days sober and the clutches continue... see you /hear you tomorrow, IYH.