*Edited*

*Edited*

Well, firstly, be aware of one thing, my friend. You have an extensive network of friends here on ths site who care for you and want the best for you. Please continue to feel free to express yourself on this site. It can only be benefitial.
You acknowledge that this "issue" is very problematic. You know it's wrong. It all comes down to fighting the same YH, regardless of what particular form he may take. So what exactly should you do? I don't have the answer to that. Maybe someone else here has an answer, maybe a professional, I don't know. But what I can tell you is we care about you, man. Don't have the attitude that you are alone, and fighting this massive YH by yourself.

*Edited*

I'm uncapping a lot of  feeling that have been bottled up inside of me for a very long time. so if anything I write sounds nonsensical I do apologize.

Hey Yehuda!!

You certainly have a unique challenge. But on the other hand, yours is very much the same as ours. You have an urge to do something which you know is wrong. So do we. You can't control that urge once it comes over you. Neither can we. When you are finished acting upon your urge you feel low and worthless and hopeless......... So do we!!! As Abie Rottenberg once said "You and I are much the same!!!"

So first of all you are not alone. You have come to the right place. But I would like to warn you. This site is only a true success for those who are truly committed to making real changes in their lives. Change is difficult. This will be no different. I fear that until you are ready to be truly open about your feelings and your struggles, you will not be able to fully face them head on. You may want to look into a live session with a professional so he can help you set a path for yourself on the way to a full recovery. But one thing is for sure. Posting may feel good, but without a plan it is possibly just the Yetzer Hara's way of making you think that you are working on it, so you will get more depressed when you fall again.

Please take my advice. Look yourself in the mirror. Decide if you are ready to make this journey. Think about what is the best way for you to do that. Once you've done this, then the posting and the chizuk can be invaluable tools to help you stay the course. Now that I've said my piece, I will give you the official welcome. (Please read through the "GYE Program in a Nutshell". It is very important.)

Welcome to our community, you have finally come home!

We're all in the same boat here. Tzuras Rabim Chatzi Nechama   Once you've arrived, there's no turning back. Everyone here will just grab a hold of you and pull you up with them!

GYE Program in a Nutshell: (Right Click the link and press "Save Link/Target As" to save the PDF file to your computer).

'Guard Your Eyes' offers a unique approach to helping people by recognizing that there are many different levels in the struggle for "Shmiras Ainayim" and "Shmiras Habris". After studying the experience of hundreds of religious strugglers over the past few years, we put together the suggestions and recommendations that we feel are best for the various levels. We divided the tools, features and services that GYE offers into 8 different levels. This "GYE Program in a Nutshell can help people quickly identify at what level of the struggle they are at, and which tools and features would help them most at their particular level.

Here are some quick things you can do to help you jump straight into recovery:

1) Make sure to install a strong filter. It will be almost impossible to break free of this while having all the garbage within a mouse click away. See this page for one good filter option, along with instructions on how to install it best – and give away the password to our "filter Gabai"… See this page for another 20 (or so) filter ideas and information… We also highly advise installing "Reporting Software" such as webchaver.org to give you some accountability, because filters alone are usually not sufficient and they can often be bypassed.

2) Join the daily Chizuk e-mail lists to get fresh chizuk every day.

3) Scientific studies have shown that it takes 90 days to change a neural thought pattern that was ingrained in the brain through addictive behaviors. Did you join the 90 day chart on-line? Sign up over here.

4) Post away on this forum! You will get tons of daily Chizuk and support. This disease can't be beat alone. It works best when you get out of isolation!

5) GuardYourEyes also offers many free anonymous phone conferences where you can join a group of other frum Yidden, along with an experienced sponsor. See www.guardyoureyes.org > Tools > Phone Conferences for many different options. Our conferences are taking place every day, morning, noon and night… Joining a phone group would be a tremendous step in the right direction for you and help you learn freedom from this addiction. Not only will you learn the secret of the 12-Steps – which is known to be the world's most powerful program for beating addiction having helped millions world wide, but the daily call will be another way of GETTING OUT OF ISOLATION and connecting with others who are going through what you are.

6) If you need more general guidance, write to our e-mail helpline at gye.help@gmail.com or call our hotline at 646-600-8100.

7) Download and read the "Guard Your Eyes Handbook". This handbook outlines the GYE approach in detail, and makes our network much more effective and helpful for people. The handbook has two parts:

A) The first part, "Attitude & Perspective", details 30 basic principles to help us maintain the proper attitude and perspective on this struggle. Here are some examples: Understanding what we are up against, what it is that Hashem wants from us, how we can use this struggle for tremendous growth, how we can deal with bad thoughts, discovering how to redirect the power of our souls, understanding that every little bit counts, learning how to bounce back up after a fall, and so on and so forth…

The second part, "The 18 Tools", detail suggested tools and techniques, in progressive order, beginning with the most basic and fundamental approaches to dealing with this addiction, and continuing down through increasingly earnest and powerful methods. No matter what level our addiction may have advanced to, we will be able to find the right tools to break free in this handbook!

May Hashem be with you!

bochur,
you are not alone, im helping a really shtark mir guy with the same thing right now

there are people here who can share

although ive never done this particular thing, i myself feel i have alott to share from my own experiences

because acting out is not only sexual, but also for the emotional connection, and this is something many of us who have acted out have studied and grown from

so hopefully later tonight i can return and maybe share a thing or two

till then,, keeep on trucking!!

I hear your problem.  My advice to you, if you're ready to hear it, is to try and stop.  If you can't that means your an addict.  Once you realize you're an addict you can enroll yourself in a group like (SA-sexaholics anonymous) and they will help you.  That's what I did and it really worked.  If you need any more advice or need to shmooze email me anytime at workingmyprogram@gmail.com.

Yehuda0612 wrote on 12 May 2011 02:42:


Hi.

I think I might have experienced exactly what you are describing when I was a similar age/a bit younger.  Feel free to PM me.

Good luck going that extra bit and making a full, perfect 613!

Edit:
What I found, looking back, is that what I experienced and did is not actually "who" I am.  I know some people unfortunately took it that way, and are still struggling with that.  It's "what" I did.  What I was doing was simple enough to stop (well, relatively speaking), but what I did not realize at the time is that it was a symptom of a greater problem.  The problem was an extremely strong compulsion towards sexually deviant behavior.  This was manifest in different ways as I got older, and had "access" to other environments.

There are all sorts of reasons (and solutions) for what I experienced.  The important thing is not to label yourself any more than someone who, on holiday in the Bahamas, eats a sneaky, treif, chocolate bar.  And just because someone ate it with you doesn't mean you need to build up a huge confrontation with the guy in your head.

With me, I was able to...  move on.  Awkwardness need not last with those people.  Well, OK - there's always a tiny, niggling, thing.  But it subsides with time, and if you can honestly guard your thoughts and actions.

workingmyprogram wrote on 12 May 2011 05:58:


so brilliant. listen to him. there is no shorter way to say it.

ok pal. lend me your ear, i'll share you some experiences of my own.

Although lust can take place in many forms, and with many types of people, porn, hetero, homo,objects, etc. , they share some basic ingredients which run through them all.

one principle is this: no one ever reached puberty and suddenly grabbed someone/thing, and acted out; when we act out, it is due to an immense amount of events that preceded this behavior. By incorrectly reacting to those events, we have let all our emotions, discipline, and boundries to run wild. At that point, we have no more self esteem and self security; therefor we rely on drugs and other dependencies to make our selves feel better.

in the area of sex, whether it be with another or to self, the same is true-we are looking to lust and be lusted after

we want the emotional connection, the attention, the fantasy,

we see a woman in the fruit store give a smile that lights up our whole being and makes us feel loved and taken care of

in chassidishe books this is called ''chein shel sheker'', this lady never met you, smiled at someone else, yet your mind is replaying that scene again and again, you begin to imagine getting together......

why this process?

it is because we are lacking love and other necessary emotions and think we can get it in our dimyon through sexual fantasy

even when we act out, we KNOW our partner is not as good looking as we imagine, but we don't care because it is our fantasy imagining what we NEED that is then intensely at work

i am in SA. I found out after many years that i am a lust addict. anyhow, my sponsor in SA told me he knew s/o that acted out with a same gender person, and the guy didnt even ever ask the other person's name- that is how much the fantasy corrupted the reality-they did THAT together and never even asked each other's name-heck, i even know my barber's name (ehud)!

so in SA shprach, this is called the misconection

why do i mention this?

because in your particular story i have merited to help a few people,
and they chose to act out with the same gender because for whatever reason, that was what filled up that misconnection and made them feel emotionally whole (in their fantasies)
the SA lit. says that when we act out, we are really reaching out our arms and saying to the other person or object of lust "make me whole!"

so people who have same sex attraction, who are gay, who are whatever you call them-they all have the same fear:
"am i gay? oh, God, to lust after women is one thing, but men? animals? children? flowerpots? that is just imaginable, vile unnatural, fill in the blank

because of this, these people need to know that it makes almost no difference why or how they chose these objects of desire-the same misconnection idea exists, and the same tools help for them.

is it true that a bochur in mir with SSA will have it a bit rough at forst because his object of lust is sleepng in same room as him, or in the shuls, mikvas, and streets everywhere?
a bit. but it actually makes no difference. because once you recover, you can and should be able to not feel so "triggered" by your triggers.

i just met a guy in SA in the park. He told me he was triggered to.....cold weather! what?! well, i dont have time to explain that one, but it makes no difference.

i do not know if you are a lust addict.
an addict means they have a problem that they want to stop and cant.

but let's say you are a non-addict.
the roots of addiction and the turmoil of your innards are the same-you have fear, anger,resentment, indifference, social struggles in reationships, relationships of dependancy, to control others or other low self esteem, to try to be my own god and use my self will to run my life, which this deosnt work well so i go bananas from that....

there is much to discuss my friend, but this is a start. i think that if you did this act, you have crossed the line very far of "just talking to girls in the pizza shop" and need to know you have something real to deal with and exploit.
it is not scary. trust me. i too learned these things about my struggles, now i see that these struggles are making me become the happiest and closest person to God as there can hope to be.
if you are in EY we can meet you and chat, if that would help you, son. do not be afraid. get out of isolation.

there are many like you.

and me.

and them.

and everyone. hey, we ALL have what to be proud of and to work on.

stay here and post, get your tools, see if SA is good for you or harmful-you know how many frum people i know in SA? if not sa, a phone conference, tools tools tools

find out how did this come so far, and besed on others experiences what they did to get better and happier, and how you can too

tools tools tools

pm people here you think are smart
post exactly whats going on and ask what to do

love,
avi/tzaddik90

yehuda,

now, please tell us perhaps how old you are, what has been going on in your life, if it is nec. tell us how you "found" these other people, nothing explicit, triggering, or suggestive.

but let's try to understand just how did a sweet yid like you come to htis, then we can work together to grow, and then bust out of this craziness.

are your parents alive? married? is acting out at home a problem too, with family? what are your other struggles? how this this effect your yeshiva day? do you have friends? were you abused? any other trauma, or weakness? let us a bit more into your world so we can all work together, friend

tzaddik90/Special Weapons And Tactics wrote on 12 May 2011 15:13:


His profile says 16 - I do not think we should be pressuring him to share a huge amount of information in relative public.

I believe he is desperately seeking guidance with how to address an immediate threat (perceived or real), as well as longer-term repair.

Hi yehuda
its very brave to be so open with your issue
it may be neccessary to arrange a special section to deal with these feelings
but in the mean time you can use the mainstream being that all addictions have a lot in common
(speacially as it is s*x related)
Hatzlocho rabbah

Yehuda - you are not alone. There are a few threads on this site about this already.

Now the fact that you acted out with a bocher does not mean you have a same sex addiction problem. I myself started off that way as well. When i dig back to my 12-16 age that's all that was available that made me feel happy, intimate, loved, etc. and there for i did it. (without understanding that at that point.i hade a loving family but there was something i was looking for..) Then i decided to stop (whether it was because i thought about getting caught and all the shame that will come from that? don't remember)  And a few years later the issue started with girls and myself. Anyway- my point is - chances are you wont rid this need for attention, love, acting out, until you dig deeper as all the above suggested. by me it took 18 years till i learned its coming from something else.

Once you hit a point like this- it wont leave on its own. It will take work. You can change your drug of choice (from boys to girls to self) but it wont leave. And if it does - from my experience it will come back.

You are a lucky boy that you found this site at this time. I dont know how often you have internet access. Please come join us and learn about this monster you are fighting. the cause and the solution.

Sorry for rambling - hope you will find something helpful.

We are all in the same boat. So why not join the party?

Please my friend do it for yourself!