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Nisayon you can't overcome??
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Im Paga be’cha menuval zeh, mushchei'hu le- BEIS HAMEDRASH! This board is for divrei Torah relating to our struggle with the Yetzer Hara, from the entire spectrum of Tanach, Chazal, Mussar and Chassidus. On this board there will be no posts about personal struggles and no debates. Only TORAH CHIZUK.
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TOPIC: Nisayon you can't overcome?? 322 Views

Nisayon you can't overcome?? 19 Jun 2019 22:10 #341823

Today in the chizuk email there was a quote from a sefer "Tikunot and Hadrachot". I am not familiar with this sefer and would like to know if anyone knows about it. My guess is that it is a relatively new sefer.
The reason for my interest is that the quote mentioned an idea that is very widespread - that Hashem doesn't give a person a nisayon that they can't overcome. There is a basic logic to this that an insurmountable nisayon is pointless, the person can't possibly gain schar or grow from it and punishment for the inevitable failure would be unfair.
The thing is that I remember hearing (and I at one point did look it up) that the Ramban in sefer Shaar Hagemul says something to the effect of this only being true in the context of tzadikim gemurim who face nisyonos for the purpose of showing the world their tzidkus and being mekadesh shem shamayim. For the rest of us it would seem then that our nisyonos could be chances for us to grow and get schar or also results of our avairos. But it is not guaranteed that we will overcome these nisyonos or even that it is possible for us to overcome all of them. I assume that in such a nisayon a person is not held responsible b'dinay shamayim for the failure that is beyond their abilities to withstand, otherwise it is really hard to understand.
I could be mistaken about the Ramban's meaning and others might argue on him. But does anyone know of an early source for the idea of all nisyonos being passable. Is there a Rishon or even a Gemara that implies this? Is it written in any seforim of baaley mussar or machshava? Many newer seforim I have seen that are chizuk seforim and also many sifrei chassidus mention it without a source but that it is taken for granted ("davar yadua...."). I would really like to know the original source of this very well known idea.
Shkoyach!

Re: Nisayon you can't overcome?? 19 Jun 2019 22:41 #341826

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There's a nice discussion about it here:
https://forum.otzar.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=22363

Here are some more on the topic of improper thoughts:

R’ Chaim of Volozhin writes in Kesser Rosh Ch. 136:
מחשבה רעה גם הראשונים לא ניצלו מזה כדאמרו רז"ל ג' דברים אין אדם כו'. ואם מסיח דעתו מן המחשבה רעה בזו כופה הסטרא אחרא, ואם מחשב בזה זו רעה חולה.

Rabbi Tzvi Elimelech of Dinov in Derech Pikudecha, LS35.
ודע ידידי כי אין הקב"ה הבא בטרוניא עם בריותיו וחלילה לחשוב על הבורא ית' שיחשב לו לעון מה שנופל בפתע פתאום איזה מחשבה רעה בציור העבירה ועירותה ותיכף מסיר המחשבה ממחשבתו כי כל זה הוא לאונסו, ואונס רחמנא פטריה... רק כשנזכר שזה אסור ואף על פי כן מאריך במחשבה ומצייר עריבות העבירה במחשבתו, אפילו אינו מחשב לעשות העבירה רק מאריך ומחשב ציור עריבות הזנות זה עבר חוקף הפר התורה. רק זאת יעשה האדם ויחי', תיכף כשנזכר שהוא עבירה יסיח דעתו ליראה ולאהבה ולתורה. וידחה המחשבה רעה ממחשבתו ויכוון לקיים ולא תתורו.

Maamorei Shlomo Ch. 16
מאת רבי שלמה הרכבי הי"ד, מנהל רוחני דישיבת 'שער התורה' בגרודנא.
הט"ז אורח חיים* כתב שאין האדם בעל בחירה במחשבתו, ולכן אמרו חז"ל (ב"ב קס"ד, ב) 'שלושה אין אדם ניצול מהם בכל יום', ואחד מהם הוא הרהורי עבירה, כי הוא אינו בעל בחירה במחשבה ואינו בעלים על המחשבה. ובחירתו מתחלת אחרי שכבר נפלה המחשבה בלבו, שאז יכול להסירה ולהסיעה לדבר אחר, אבל לעצור במחשבתו ולמנוע שלא תפול מחשבה רעה בלבו זה מן הנמנע. אמנם צריך לדעת ולהבין כי יסוד המחשבה תולדה מן הנהגת האדם ומצבו, ובמה שהאדם עוסק, שם הוא מחשבתו על פי רוב. ואם כן, אף על פי שאינו בעל בחירה על מחשבתו, באופן ישיר, מכל מקום הוא בעל בחירה על ידי זה שימלא לבו במחשבות טהורות, תורה ויראת שמים, ולא יהיה מקום ליצר הרע ומחשבותיו להכנס, כמו שכתב הרמב"ם (סוף הלכות איסורי ביאה) שאין מחשבת עריות מתגברת אלא בלב פנוי מן החכמה, כי במקום חכמה אין מקום ליצר ומחשבותיו להכנס, ובאופן זה יש דרך לבחירה גם על מחשבתו.

Tanya Ch. 27:
If, his sadness stems from sinful thoughts and desires enter his mind, then ... he should, on the contrary, be happy in his lot; for although these sinful thoughts enter his mind, he averts his attention from them. By averting his mind from sinful thoughts, he fulfills the mitzva, “You shall not follow after your heart and after your eyes, by which you go astray.”, as chazal have said: “When one passively abstains from sin, he is rewarded as though he had actively performed a mitzvah.” Consequently, he should rejoice in his compliance with the injunction just as he does when performing an actual mitzvas asei. On the contrary, such sadness is due to conceit… for were he to recognize his level, that he is very far from the rank of a true tzaddik, then surely, this is the challenge Hashem gives to the the Beinonim: To subdue the evil impulse and the thought that rises from the heart to the mind, and to completely avert his mind from it, repulsing it as it were with both hands. With every repulsion of this thought from his mind, the sitra achra is suppressed… Therefore, one should not feel depressed or very troubled at heart, even if he be engaged all his days in this conflict with the thoughts which will always enter his mind. For perhaps this is what he was created for, and this is the service demanded of him — to subdue the sitra achra constantly.

==
* I wasn't able to find such a taz...
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Re: Nisayon you can't overcome?? 19 Jun 2019 23:10 #341827

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My guess, without textual basis.

There is no logical point in being given a nisayon that one cannot overcome.
Because if it is 100 percent not possible to overcome it, then it is not a nisayon.

But do we always know what nisayons are given to us...either at the time they are given, or with hindsight?
Last Edit: 19 Jun 2019 23:13 by ColinColin.

Re: Nisayon you can't overcome?? 23 Jun 2019 04:24 #341887

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ColinColin wrote on 19 Jun 2019 23:10:
My guess, without textual basis.

There is no logical point in being given a nisayon that one cannot overcome.
Because if it is 100 percent not possible to overcome it, then it is not a nisayon.

But do we always know what nisayons are given to us...either at the time they are given, or with hindsight?

How about to fail, and grow, so you can do better next time and really acquire something big?
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